Flukes

[Linda]

Found our lovely Benegoi dead in the water today, and another koi so poorly I could take a skin scrape by just lifting her out of the water. She died later in the morning. We have flukes, goodness knows how such a severe attack has occured they all seemd fine on Friday. All water tests are fine, no abnormalities that we can find. We have treated with the new NTL BDS treatment. Two other koi look very poorly so I'm expecting the worst. This sort of infestation is often associated with dirty ponds - but ours is far from that. The settlement chamber is cleaned every week and there isn't any evidence of foul matter any where in the block built system that we can see.
To cap it all the dogs having a rough time too, shes had several Ischmeic attacks which have left her confused and frightened. She seems a little better today, but I think we have to face the inevitable soon.

[Scotty24]

Linda
Really, really sorry to hear about your fish I hope the treatment works and your other Koi recover.

Glad your dog is a little better today and hope she continues to improve.
How old is she?

Sending lots of hoping things get better

[Linda]

Thank you Sue, Lucy the dog is 16. She is a lovely collie cross, blind as a bat and deaf as a post these past couple of years, seizing up in the hips too. She sleeps most of the time these days. These mini strokes seem to be the last thing .. she can't walk straight and is very confused, although as I said she is somewhat less agitated today. I used to work geriatric's and know how frightening these attacks can be for people, so I can appreciate Lucy's confusion. I've made up my mind that if she doesn't pick up over the next day or two, I'm going to have to do the kinder thing. I don't want to leave her on her own at home. I can be around most of this week so will monitor things closely. Vet thinks it's probably time to let go. I don't know, I can't type for tears! In the grand scheme of things we are such a blessed family, and I feel a little bit shamed when I think about the terrible situations around the world.

[seanmckinney]

Bummer, not a good weekend/weekstart.

[alison]

Linda - so sorry to hear about the fish and your lovely dog. I lost a large goldfish last week. I came out last tuesday and found it dead in the middle of the lily leaves. It had no colour on it at all. Just really white. I couldn't see anything wrong with it at all, so I am just assuming it died of natural causes.
I know what it is like to lose a pet that has been in the family for such a long time as well, so if that does happen Linda I will be thinking of you. I know what you mean about the problems in the world, but our own lives are just as important and when things are troubling us they are as important as the 'bigger picture' and how you feel about your fish and your little dog is just as important in your life. There is not too much we can do about a lot of things that go on in the world but if we can do something then I am sure that we do. If we make our family and our pets lives happy then we have done our best in situations that we have control over.

[Scotty24]

Linda
Alisons second paragraph says everything I was thinking but she expressed it so much better than I could.

[AJC]

Thats bad news linda you probably know how to treat the prob, but for everyones else's benefit, you need to treat the pond 3 times now, to get all eggs that hatch, and seeing its late in the season I would do it twice then twice more when the weather turns next spring, a lot of flukes will mean a lot of eggs in your system

[alison]

Now this will show how much I don't know about things , but what are flukes? Could my fish have died from them when I couldn't see anything wrong on the surface so to speak. Maybe I need to look them up somewhere... My fish seemed fine all the time though, there was no reason to suppose he would up and die on me.
How are things with Lucy now Linda? Has she had any more attacks?

[AJC]

For alison http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/flukes.htm

flukes are one of the worse parasites you can have in large numbers, but i susspect its more to do with the weather than your system linda, they woke up and bred again I am thinking, its been spring like the past few weeks, it was warmer in october than it was in august!!

[alison]

Thankyou Alan.

[Linda]

Hi Alan, I know what you mean about the weather, but we're heated to 21 degrees so no temp fluctuations to worry about. We had a minor fluke outbreak on one koi about 3 months ago, a fairly new 20 cms koi, we treated the pond with Paradex (x3) instead of supaverm (which would have meant moving the Sturgeon) and thought we had the situation sorted. We did follow up scapes but only on the original fish - she was clear. 6 weeks ago we lost our oldest koi, who was 15 years old - she'd come from my mums pond a couple of years ago. We thought she'd gone of old age and didn't worry too much at all. We did do another scrape of the 1st koi who had had the fluke infestation and were most pleased with her progress. An ulcer by her gill had required antibiotics, but was slowly but surely healing nicely. The two koi we lost earliier this week were big ladies, 60cm & 62cm long, we'd had them a year and they seemed very robust and were certainly not the ones I'd have worried about! We heated last winter so they had put on steady good growth. We were going to winter them this year (lower temp) and had just last week been discussing bringing the temp down over the next few weeks. The new NTL labs BDS treatment is supposed to be a single dose treatment, they say only retreat after 10 days if fish do not respond to 1st treatment. We're going to be bowling every fish this weekend, taking scrapes and examining them all over for any wound sites and deciding on any individual treatment regime if necessary.
If there are any wounds which require topical or antibiotic treatment then the heat will go up not down to aid healing. This BDS one treatment does sound a bit too easy. Following the Paradex, I think we should have checked more koi each week for say 6 weeks following the first fluke infestation. We have certainly paid for not doing so. The fish lost were quite expensive purchases. The BDS treatment is £36 for our 6500 gals, which is a bit cheaper than the 3 bottles of Paradex. If this doesn't work we'll have to go down the superverm route. Only problem with that is I really don't want to have to put the poor sturgeon back into the goldfish pond. He's huge now- over 3ft long.
You do need a microscope to see the flukes Alison. I've a mini video of them which I'll see if I can upload or find a link to. If it wasn't so bad for the fish, they're quite interesting.
Lucy is up and down.. I've arranged dog sitters for next week as I'm working away a bit. I'm taking each day as it comes with her and as long as she's not in pain then will wait and see. No further attacks, but she's not gone any further than toileting just outside the back door, then a nibble of food then back to sleep. Passing away in her sleep would be my wish for her.

[aitch]

Hi Linda - I never had a dog or any pets really so I can't imagine how you are feeling - really sorry. It's such a difficult situation to be in, where it's up to you to decide. Hope everything works out OK.

I have a feeling my Mum will be in your situation soon - her Golden Retriever is 15 now and they aren't supposed to live that long. She's deaf and has bad hips, and sleeps a lot now (the dog that is!). I think it will be hard for my Mum as she only lost my Dad last year after 40 years of marriage (last week in fact) and as there were five children it was all pretty noisy in the house. One of my sisters is mentally handicapped but is now striking out on her own (with support from the local authority) so she left home about 6 months ago, leaving my Mum with the dog and a much quieter house. Once the dog goes, my Mum will really be living on her own which she has never done before in her life and she's now in her mid-60s. We try and see my Mum a lot, in fact I was on holiday with her and my little boy (hubby couldn't get way from work) which was great - but I do worry how the dog going will affect her.

Sorry - rambled on a bit - guess I'm making up for being offline so long!

[alison]

I think the dog would have been a lot of comfort to your mum when your dad passed away as I know when ever we have been very upset our cat really knows or when we are ill. We had a wonderful cat called Trigger who lived to be 16 and he would never leave me if he thought I was ill, and they are great for a cuddle when you are upset. They are very theraputic. Maybe your mum will get another dog after a few months , as when you have always had animals they become a permanant part of your home. I know when Velcro dies (he is 11 now) we have said that we won't get another, but I think in time we will. Anyway I hope your mums dog lives for a long time yet
Linda I hope Lucy is okay this week. How are the fish doing?

[aitch]

Thanks Alison - I guess she has been a comfort, although now my Mum isa permanent gad-about she finds the dog a bit tying and ends up having to put her in kennels a lot. I'm not sure she'll get another - she says not, but I think it may be something for further in the future. Having nursed my Dad for the last two years (he had Motor Neurone Disease) I think she is enjoying being able to go out and about whereas she was obviously very restricted before.

Meant to say by the way, love the website and all the pictures - it's very inspiring, especially as it's got so much on it.